NC State's Undisputed GOATs: We Only Agreed on 3 — Tuffy Talk

We said Chris Dunn is the greatest kicker in NC State history, some of you were furious, so we settled a bigger question: at how many positions does NC State actually have an UNDISPUTED GOAT? Ethan, Greg, Macon and Layton go position by position — and only three names survive.

Before the debate: Jacoby Brissett's new deal with Arizona, worth up to $21 million. UNC's general manager getting put on paid administrative leave five weeks before kickoff. And the three defensive transfers who could swing NC State's season.

Then Ethan closes with the question nobody's ready for — with four-star Gunner Rivers, Philip's son, on the way, who's actually NC State's starting quarterback a year from now?

The three undisputed GOATs, the one that got away, and a whole lot of arguing in between.

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Transcript

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We don't need a mic on some big TV stage just passion the fans and a whole lot of faith So if you bleed red and you holler all night then brother you're exactly right This is Tuffy talk where the pack fans belong pouring out for the red and the white sing along We'll break it all down Yeah we'll call it straight This is our show Go pack go state Tuffy talk fired up and loud the Wood Pack Nation We're a hell of a crowd from the first pitch to the final play toffee talk Let's roll today What is going on Wolf Pack Nation Welcome to another edition of the Toughie Talk live show Just yesterday I came out with a tweet and actually on the countdown tweet and ruffled some feathers saying that Chris Dun is the goat So we're gonna discuss it here today later on in the live show here and really debate how many positions as you say truly does have an undisputed goat With that being said he got myself laid Smith he got our usual crew Ethan you got Greg the leg here but you got our man making back with us man making always pleasure to have you back on brother Yeah man glad to be back here and out for a little bit Yeah no so with that being said you know first of all Greg you're reminding us man fall camp begins soon man you know it's been what now what two weeks removed here from ACC Media Day here It's a and also two as well just for those that that are you know that that care which I'm sure a lot of a lot of you know fans out there do We will not have another Sunday until I think February where we do not have football on Sunday So we will not have a Sunday list football sorry a football list Sunday until February So great it feels pretty good right ready Had a little mini vacation last week and hosted from the airplane that you know good time And now it's time to get locked in so the football season and the NC State season is going to get started here real quick for us Heck yeah heck yeah so Ethan what you most excited about right now Man football season it's right around the corner like you said and you know the NFL like I know we're not an NFL show but you know preseason kind of gets you into it gets the juices flowing a little bit I mean fall camp right Greg's got us got us covered there I mean that's this week right so time time to get excited Yeah so that being said we're not even gonna waste any time here We're gonna jump right into our our first segment here Pack Pro the week Pack Pro of the week and of course and of course this week is is of no debate whatsoever That is Mr Jacoby Brisette locking in for a deal that locks him in for 2026 Uh it's a one year deal worth$15.5 million for the Arizona Cardinals with a chance to get up to$21 million here uh you know making just uh today Actually I put out a countdown tweet showcasing Mr Jacoby Burset actually 12 years ago pulling off one of the most insane individual efforts and insane players I've ever seen which I do kind of wanna jump into a little bit of grind my gears there But you know so but so focusing on this part though locking in Jacoby Burset for the Arizona Cardinals here even though they drafted Carson Beck quarterback out of Miami He's definitely gonna be the presumed lock and loaded set in forget starter at least for the first half of the season You would imagine you know and then depending on how Carson Beck develops maybe for the entire season Yeah I mean you can't I mean this is a huge win for Jacoby I mean the Cardinals really he forced her hand and they had no really great path to go to get the in the wins they needed to um and they they weren't winning the honestly they weren't a winning program where either way And they just you know it's either uh Carson Beck or I don't know who their other guys in the roster right now But they were it was not not a lot of options for them And I think Jacoby's contract was a two year contract with like some mom twelve million dollars I think is what I saw it was And he restructured it to now be just a gives him a fifteen and a half million dollar base salary and incentives give a maximum value of 21 million He doesn't have doesn't add any more years to his contract He just gets more money So props to Jacoby I mean he's they're gonna it's gonna be a probably a really tough season They do get a healthier Marvin Harrison Jr Back over there And um they'll be interested to see what Michael Wilson can do but you know he's gonna have some options I do add you Mark You're my love I just I'll be curious how well that offensive line holds up for him But at the end of the day this is about his contract and he won this so good for him couldn't say better myself If I do wanna ask you though one thing that did concern me though is there were some videos that came out obviously focusing more on Jeremiah Love being that he's a big uh you know fantasy football potential prospect Uh you know and there's a lot of videos coming out of the Arizona Cardinals offensive line looking uh little to be desired here for sure Uh and so you know does it concern you at all here about I mean I guess is a concern for Jacoby but also to as well Do you do you say that's honestly even probably a better thing in terms of potentially saying a full Jacoby preset season this upcoming year saying well maybe let's not throw the the rookie quarterback you know into that it's that sandstorm Yeah yeah I I I to me Carson Beck is not it Like he's okay you know like I don't I don't look at this as like you're just he's Jacoby Burset is just keeping his seat warm until Carson Beck takes over And that's as somebody who has Carson Beck on a couple of my dynasty fantasy teams like yeah you think it's gonna go that way But also Beck was like a third fourth rounder Like may not happen you know it may not come together for for Beck And so he asked me I think it's Preset's job right now And if you know he's able to keep Arizona I mean they had the third pick right So um they must have won what 2 3 games last year Four Um if he's able to keep them afloat maybe go 500 And I think he can hang on to that job I don't think this is all right he's gonna start 4 games 5 games and then BEC is gonna take over I think Jacoby has an opportunity to kind of run with this And you know it's a one year deal and you know at this point in Jacoby's career it's kind of always the contract season Like he's not gonna get a 3 4 year deal Right so it's all right he's playing for this If he does well with the Cardinals maybe they re up them for a year maybe he goes somewhere else who's got some more turnover So I think Jacoby's got an opportunity to to kind of run with the job and zone right now Yeah well and Greg I think Ethan kind of mentioned it here But you know talking about Jacoby and you know not only just you know I I think it speaks a lot into the fact that he's going into his I think it was yeah 12th NFL season uh but also two people giving him a hard time saying you know why would you sit out Cause Ethan he actually had a 1 in 11 record I think you're right Cardinals won like four three four games last year but Jacoby's record was Wine 11 which a lot of people are saying why would you sit out you know you had a Wine 11 record last year but just like making said you know good for him Go get your money while you can Yeah it's the NFL is a very short career for a lot of folks He's been able to parlay that into a 12 year career being a backup I you know a lot of people will say that the backup is the best job in the NFL or backup quarterback that is um yeah he had like making said he had all the leverage here Um I agree with Ethan I don't think or whoever said this is a 4 5 game and then hand it off to Carson Beck They didn't pay him in that regard Um yeah he's had success He's been on some really crappy teams too Um you know people forget that You know I think he did get us a mobile ring with the Patriots if I'm not mistaken Um I feel like at least one right I think he did with the Brady Yeah yeah but uh yeah you know but when he's had the opportunity to start they haven't been very good teams um with the exception I think he did fill in during Brady's suspension That would probably been it been his best team that he played on But yeah go make that money when you can Because it's that well is gonna dry up sooner rather than later Yeah absolutely so again huge shout out to Jacoby Burset for sure excited to see him starting on Sundays and you know Thursdays whatever you know what I mean And again always good to have that quarterback you blood still flowing So with that being said though uh I you know was kind of coming up with some plans on Uh well actually you know what before you even go to the next segment I do actually wanna uh uh uh come out with an apology on behalf of myself and Greg as last week's live show might have might have come across a little bit like this Holy shit Fuck me now fuck that fuck you you So with that being said I just want to apologize on behalf of myself and Greg Here is that first off you know keep my name out your mouth Number two there were no F bombs dropped by by me Well well so so a little bit of background here So so you know ever so often you know depending on depending on the time how long the show goes Sometimes you know we may say alright you know maybe it's time to to to drop a little nugget here And it was funny because uh you know what we try to do with tufty talks Basically take our live show and split it into clips and post them as individual clips on on YouTube Whilst I was posting the one uh which uh I was talking about our you know one offensive tackle being suspended and uh when you upload on YouTube there's one question asked you is is there any profanity uh in the video And you have to answer yes or no It's like well yeah but not that much But I was like I don't want to take it out It's funny it's good stuff and so I was like okay I'll just add a little like bleep you know over them or whatever it was It was the funniest thing so anyway obviously again it's not it's not something we do a lot but just it was the funniest clip to to to edit up there Good stuff I did get a laugh when you drop all the paper chat yesterday Yeah it was good so all right jump back into it though So again as I was saying last night was coming up with the plan for tonight's live show but then all of a sudden this morning I'll poop broke out all of a sudden crap hit the wall And uh um you know so Mr Mike Lombardi uh general manager for UNC gets suspended well gets put on administrative leave paid administrative leave Uh which again as we've said before and as Ethan said we are not you know we're not NFL talk we're not ram talk fully understand that So I I don't know someone spend too much time on on the Michael Lombardi piece here But uh Ethan I'll let you go first What was your initial reaction when you saw that pop up on your phone this morning My initial reaction is how old is the girl That was kind of my first thing like it seems pretty straightforward Yeah I I mean my good my good buddy Brian Moreland put up put up some odds and they were pretty good odds I think he had a girl at plus 300 and I was like I was like it was definitely a girl plus 300 grade odds So um no I I think like it's it's great to laugh at you and these expense But I wonder if this is you and siege starting their due diligence to figure out how they can get out of this mess that they've got themselves in Um can they fire these guys for cause so they don't have to pay him stuff like that Now you know is is Bill behind this Obviously that would be a different Is he just asking somebody to kind of keep his seat warm as UNC doing this Like I'd be kind of interested to know those details Who is behind this Um but yeah I I mean it's it's clearly just an absolute a messes um undersells it Right Um and I think we all kind of know this has a uh a lifespan on it that is coming to an end I I feel like pretty rapidly so um maybe this is the beginning of that Maybe it's not I don't know but um yeah I I definitely think this is something with uh a girl Yeah well and uh yeah I mean honestly the fact that it wasn't even the the football program that that made the decision The fact it was the school that made the decision It was it was an HR ministry They did say they're under they're under investigation by the same um committee that investigates nil funding Um yeah I I wonder if it's actually more than just or something different than that Personally but it's like it's maybe it's a money thing and how benefits went out and might be involving a girl maybe not for him But I I I think it's a little bit more than that So yeah well and next go ahead and leave what just in gray I was Turkey That's why I say that right what in gray I was gonna make this joke and kind of hand over to you Here is that if you were to tell me that there was a a member of the UNC football staff that got put on paid administrative leave I would have said well Bobby Petrino strikes again But nope it was a Petrino I forgot I forgot the other day I heard somebody talking about Petrino and I was like man I forgot that they got him too under like well they got him because he got in a major accident his motorcycle wasn't like just like oh we dug around Well no I mean this is like his third stop since then Um oh oh you mean that the UNC got him Yeah the UNC got oh I thought you meant that they found out about between us but I thought that you meant that oh no go ahead Greg Yeah no I think the Lombardi thing isn't directly tied to the nil thing because HR wouldn't necessarily get involved in something like that I don't think like when you hear the word HR you feel like it's some kind of thing that was said done um something along those lines Now the nil thing you know being announced around the same time I think it kind of might get to where Layton or Ethan whoever said it again I'm sorry I'm not working on a lot of sleep today Um that this is the beginning of them trying to start to unravel what they have going on and get rid of him with Cause uh I am curious you know they had that whole explanatory trip to Saudi Arabia Lombardi did uh with nil be interested to see if it has something you know the investigation has something to do with that Um but it is pretty wild when it's legal to play people and you still are getting investigated by nil Like it's all above board What are you doing that's so jacked that's getting you investigated um in today's world and landscape But I'm just gonna get my popcorn and enjoy eating it and watching from afar cause it should be it should be pretty fun over the next Probably depending on how quickly it wraps the next month to two months And again you know the football season starts in 5 weeks And you know not that he has anything to do with day to day Ops I wouldn't imagine he's probably more of an offseason guy being a GM I don't think they do a whole lot during the season but it's it's a you know Bill always says don't be a distraction I would say is a distraction but yeah but unless you're which Bill yeah yeah yeah well the the the piece I want to kind of tie it though Dancy State It's just a reminder Dancy State fans again is said this is a reminder of something that I feel like Coach Dorn always gets overlooked with Is that just you never see like this these these locker room culture issues You know like you know even even the Teddy Hall over What's that these clouds hanging over the program Well exactly well cause even like even like the Teddy Hoffman think like it was self reported like you know by by NC State Uh you know and the only thing I can even really think of is back in 2015 when you had what was it The paintball well Chad right But they know you have like like the paintball gunfighter yeah or airsoft gun fights Oh yeah polyjan whatever You know it's being dumb I mean that's not exactly and the grand scheme of things it's not like some of the things like it's not it's not again I don't want to make light of it And he's with the Bucks now but it's not Reuben Baine Jr Driving and killing someone you know or Georgia with 3,000 speeding tickets Like it's it's not that correct Great So yeah so just just setting out a reminder is again I fully understand with coach doing We want the ACC championship ceiling But once again it's a it's a coach that brings in players that are gonna and staff that are gonna represent NC State at the level that should and also to put on the field a great product that gives you really solid floor almost every single year So but again but real last thing this isn't new for Lombardi Like everything that I've seen and read and heard like he has this reputation Like he's kind of a d bag Um and he's you know was voted multiple times top 5 worst person in the league and um has disappeared from time to time Doesn't tell people what's like this seems to be his Mo And I think his greatest success is riding Bill Bellicuck's coattails Like that's kind of how he's gotten where he's gotten and again hey if it works ride that pony until it collapses like Sea Biscuit Yeah so with that being said Wolf Pack Nation we're going to jump on over to another segment here And Ethan step one more time spy for your business school church team organization Alpha Wolf CPR trains makes it easy by bringing the train directly to you Alpha Wolf CPR trains makes it easy by bringing the trainings that way You can get certified by the American Red Cross license training providers offering adult and pediatric first aid CPR and AED certification courses With successful completion participants received an official American Red Cross certification valid for two years and a meeting of sustainers convenient professional all always there when you need them So make sure to go and check them out today at Alpha Wolf CPR dot square dot site today to Ethan I'll let you take it away Yeah one of the things that I really like about what NC State did in the portal this year I thought defensively They went out and they got a playmaker at every position They they added an impact piece somebody who has produced at this level Um now Harvey Dyson was at two lanes So you know don't nitpick no don't nitpick that It was the AAC but it was a playoff team right We know that was a good good football team Um and so for me it's it's those three guys King Mac coming over from Penn State at safety It's popo acquire coming over at linebacker from Miami and Harvey Dyson whether you wanna call him a linebacker defensive end whatever I call him a edge rusher from two lane Those three guys last year combined for 137 tackles 13.5 tackles for a loss eight and a/2 sacks Now obviously a lot of those TFLs a lot of the sacks were Dyson He had eight sacks 8 out of eight and a/2 So you didn't necessarily get a ton of that from Mcguire and Mac But they the total five passes defense which is on sport reference I think they're pretty conservative with those numbers so I'm certain that that number would be higher if you were using a different rating system or I guess a different stat Um you know somebody who's who's dishing those out Um so I I I really like the impact that state has brought in on on three levels And we talk about you know do you rely on what you have internally do you bring guys in And I think state brought three guys in who have produced at this level You have Dyson who can get who can get after the quarterback I I I don't wanna say as well as anybody but it does kinda feel like that like eight sacks is a lot I mean like when's the last time state had a guy with eight sacks Was it chub chub Yeah yeah how many of them have that one year Wow I don't know It feels like they've had a bunch of guys at like five or six Peyton Wilson I think had a big year Drake Thomas had a big year but I don't think they've had anybody get up to eight Um and so to rush the quarterback at that level and then obviously acquire on Miami's defense as good as it was and King Mac at Penn State whose defense was as good as it was Um I I love it Three impact guys who I think you expect to play key roles again You you kind of come in and you wonder okay is this player X gonna take a step forward Is you know player y gonna be ready to ready to go I don't think you necessarily have that question with these three guys so produced at this level So um yeah hundred and thirty seven tackles thirteen and a half Tfl's eight and a/2 sacks from those three guys combined I think that's three guys who are going to impact and make make plenty of of havoc plays as I like to call around the football forensic state this year fact check It was Peyton Wilson who last had it at least eight It was Peyton Okay how many did he have Three yeah eight and a half eight and a half Yeah so and before that I'm guessing it was probably Chubb I'm not sure for eight Yeah I got Bradley Chubb with eight in 2016 Well two pretty good football players Rancie State yeah which we'll probably talk about them here later here in in the live show here But before we actually dive dive into a little bit more I would do wanna give a shout out real quick to our amazing Patreon Uh only$5 a month to get three members only videos per week plus access to our members only rumor chat So if we're hearing any rumors recruiting or whatever it may be anything that we feel like is of interested all to Walk Back Nation will make sure to show it in the rumors chat So make sure to go sign up today by clicking the link down description below Only$5 per month three videos per week and members only rumor chat So uh making which of those three that Ethan mentioned Do you think will make the will make the biggest impact here for this upcoming season which we can't tease too much Cause we have our defense preview coming up here this week But we'll give him a little bit of a taste here I really like Harvey Dyson I mean I I think state's gonna need some edge presence there to get the make get the pass rush Um I really like what he did at two lane You mentioned the eight sacks there That's just a really impact guy A lot of people in the country Latins in the country really would have loves have had and state made him a priority in the transfer portal Um so for me I like Harvey Dyson to be have making a really big impact there Yeah uh Greg would you agree with make us pick or would you go different route No I think it it for me I'm a I'm a big guy I believe about lines offensive and defense and so if you can get a good pass rush up front it makes everyone else's life a lot easier And and so you know there's a reason why they're coveted so much in the NFL And yeah I believe just as in what making was putting out I'll go a little bit of different route And I mean I know well you know just to just to keep keep it spicy here Uh listen I think King Mac is gonna serve a big purpose for the team this year Uh you know just his experience coming in as a senior uh you know a guy that was when he came out of high school was No 86 overall recruit the country No 6 overall safety in the country I mean was under the Pence system for for four for four years So you know again obviously we know what James Franklin that uh you know he isn't the most elite of coaches but still a very good football coach Uh so to be in his system you know four years He's definitely gonna learn a few things there that are gonna be great for in terms of keeping a locker room strong in terms of a player that you can rely on that you can you know shoulder with some weight going into this upcoming season here so I think King Mac you know it's been a while since probably Tanner Ingles then that we've had a a safety We felt uh you know really stands above above the rest And uh and I think King Matt could be that guy for this upcoming season So uh but yeah no all good all three good ones there uh there Ethan So I appreciate that and again thank you as well to our amazing sponsor Alpha CPR trains Make sure to go and check them out here today Uh so uh but actually before we get into that here I do wanna add quickly shout out here Greg And actually because I won't even bring this up necessarily in a tweet here but I know that we've had a couple of different big uh commits here recently Greg from a baseball perspective Uh and obviously we can't we don't have enough time to spend and break down us at each one individually here But is there one in particular that you really wanna highlight here for Wolfpack Nation that that really excites you Um you talking about the the the the prep guys Is that what you're referring to correct yep um I don't know like for me it's really hard because like they don't really jump out uh from a numbers perspective or ranking perspective Uh I I am always intrigued by left handed pitchers Um I feel like those guys just don't grow on trees and so I I get excited about left handed pictures Um so so maybe that's that's where I'll take this with Um um I'm guessing his name is handelog Evan Handelog Yeah yeah I think that's right Yeah I think that's how you say his last name So like his numbers don't really jump off the chart The one number if we're ever kind of still have Ethan Stat pack as our background the number with with Evan that jumps off to me is his weight Like Homeboy needs to eat a sandwich Um so we can get that velo up So so we can get him on the program like in his senior year in high school Uh that would be great uh just putting that out there into the universe But no I I do love left handed pitching Um you know there you can never have too many left handed pitchers and I'll leave it at that How much does he weigh Greg If his bio is correct or his whatever we saw it was a buck fifty So yeah I'm really hoping that was a misprint Maybe like the five was like a six or seven or an eight But I don't know Uh again he's a kid that I'm sure we'll bulk up And you know I I think that um you know who knows Um anyway Ethan did one of them jump out at you No not really I mean we talked about um we talked about him whole Gaston as well um you just kind of never know with with the high school guys You know um you know I I'd go back to Jacob dude and who wasn't really wasn't even really a guy who jumped out the fall of his freshman year And then by the spring you're like oh okay this guy throws 98 You know so it's all about the development with baseball players And so um yeah I mean if you want me to pick somebody else I'll go whole Gaston but yeah I like Greg's pick as well Yeah so real quick here I wanna spend 30 seconds here and jump on over to grandma gears really grinds my gears Alrighty here so I just have a little something to say here as there's been a couple of tweets that have come out here talking about pics for the countdown tweets of the day saying hold on can I pause you Go ahead your picks not our pics your pics so this is all on you there but aren't even bad pics So Greg I mean I mean they've all been good picks so far I don't think you know okay alright well I'll let you finish your grind my gears and I'll grind my gears off your grind my gears Okay that's fair grind my gears I but there's been a couple of tweets you know pointing out well you know did we lose that game like why did you pick that one We lost that game was like well okay you know it like like like in that and that's honestly why Greg I picked today's clip Because I said what is the most amazing play that I can think of and a game where we lost and that's what's that you just poking the bear that's all you're doing I mean what does it say that you're click farming or whatever the heck the term is I don't know for you click well engagement farming is I think I'm getting like judgment farming Yeah yeah right okay he's doing his job I know he's bringing eyes to our channel that's right So so so so what's the issue with that Greg Give it to me what you got I I don't think it's like the theme It's like you definitely write it and I'll give you props I I will give you props you write it to where you you you get them coming out of the woods You're like hmm what is toughy talk said now that I can just get on them and and bash them for for something stupid Um so yeah you're doing a good job in that regard I mean you ain't talking about the Jacoby reset tweet right I I mean look you're not wrong on some of the things you're saying It's just Wolfpack Nation has a way of expressing themselves and it's not always in a positive manner No absolutely hey listen love to find that negative in everything No hey listen I I you don't get into the content creation business without knowing that some point you're gonna hear a few negatives It's gonna happen so I will say we're not the worst cause there are some accounts out there that are way worse No absolutely no absolutely absolutely so all right well packation let's drop on over to tweets of the week So first tweet of the week here uh coming off the backs of a solid commit I mean you know making how how would you qualify that this commitment here from AK Crumble 2027 defensive back three star out of Clayton Uh but it seems like it 1 scale 1 to 10 10 being like a home run pig I was just probably like a like a nice I could do solid like 7 right here because aka cremel or I believe it's uh pronounced uh had it here a second ago It's a Kedron a Kedron Yeah yeah criminal this guy had a lot of really good offers going to high school And Clayton is not always the um the biggest NC State lean although Devin Carter came out of there And I think Sabion Jackson I'm not mistaken also came out of plate So those are two big anti state names although than a debit card did transfer out to West Virginia in his tenure Um we got Aiden Smalls from there as well Aiden Smalls it's becoming maybe more of a um thing there But Clay it's it's it's nice I like it's a close to home guy looks like he probably grew up a based on that picture grew up but NC State fan So he can get a guy in the North Carolina Piedmont area and that Raleigh area um who grew up a fan who's got some some nice offers Um nothing uh too crazy but he's got you know Georgia Tech Arkansas Um I see some Boston College Florida State Kentucky he's got some SEC offers on here Um I even see somewhere like Ohio State offering at one point so that USC so uh good places good teams I just I think it's a good pick State's kind of been you know last season They lost so many guys and transfer portal um to the other your start You're starting 4 5 defensive backs all left not saying this guy's gonna be a starter or anything like that but you just never know what these day and age is gonna be uh so tumultuous And I think the defensive backs right now it is um I think is this Charlton Warren who is the recruiter for the DBS I think it is so most guy that's playing uh pain divins He's been he's shown he's got some nice recruits the last two to three years So um yeah I like this committee I think he's the guy who will hopefully pan out force But kind of like if your point about pitchers you know and baseball commits in the prep rankings like you just don't know with these high school kids are they gonna stay you know get a you know flash a few plays here and there and wanna leave the cream always rise to top Hopefully this is what we see out of a cremel if I'm pronounced that correctly So I think it's a I think it's a really solid pickup for state I just you gotta hope it projects out well uh real quick And I'll I'll I'll jump back into this But I just saw the funniest tweet where it was a ESP and insights graphic where it had like the percent chances to make the College Ball Playoff the top 20 chances And uh and keep in mind UNC is not on this list but a UNC account court tweeted and said UNC is too high And he gave you as he's not even on the graphic which is that's just that's just peak right there That's good stuff uh Ethan though uh you know I want remember the remember times back uh you know just a few years ago Ethan where you know you'd have recruits putting out a tweet being like hey you know I you know somebody help me put together graphic you know and you'd have all these graphic design people reaching out to help put together an amazing graphic And now you got graphics are being put together by AI to announce announce commitments man Just it's it's it's a lost heart man that that you know you're not seeing really as much if at all anymore It is a lost start you know I think that used to be like if not a job like at least an internship with the football program I don't maybe it still is I don't know um I don't Yeah but anyway uh yeah you're right like you used to have a graphic for your top eight your top 45 you know your you know whatever it may be I'm 17 You're right I need to do one next time up for a new job and then a commitment date And then oh I'm cutting my list on this day And then I would be committed so exhaust Yeah like I said that used to be right right you used to hear about we used to hear about commitments and it would be like all right well you know player access committed And I was like okay well when are they announcing And I was like well I don't know they got to wait on the graphic you know and it was just kind of one of those things and you don't necessarily hear that anymore Yeah but you know Greg uh you know for me this is just another example of a guy that you know listen if we can win in our state recruiting wise let's do it Uh you know if we can get a guy that's local uh you know that's a layup option for us for us to you know invest in you know develop And you get him get him to NC State here I think AK definitely fits that mold here again not to say guy that has all the all the stars not a 4 5 star guy but again a solid like making 3 star prospect with a lot of really good offers on that offer sheet absolutely And you know when ACC Media days was happening and Coach Dorn was at the podium and he said you know NC State does more with three star recruits than anybody else in the country This is this is where where they shine And if nothing else this helps the recruiting budget cause you probably only had to spend like 10 bucks and gas money back and forth from probably to Clayton Um so yeah it helps And again it goes back to day one when Coach Lauren says he wants to build a wall around the state of North Carolina This is how you do it And um yeah so it's great when when local kids wanna come and stay home and and and rep their local local local school Yeah so our next tweet of the week here Wanna give a shout out to AC Network And and it's a yeah this one last week yeah for those that are listening It's a screenshot of from AC Media Day And the headline of the bottom said says for State State seeks not to suck Now I mean is it is this is this is AI right I feel like it has to be um I wasn't I wasn't able to verify it in either direction I I thought it was hilarious regardless yeah regardless It's funny um but this would be an all time banger if this really did populate on the screen during this segment Um but yeah I the the the real person the real brain in me says this has to be fake Like it just absolutely has to be I mean the fact that or the that or the graphics guy was from Miami haha Well but again I'll sue the fact that it says Florida State State seeks not to suck It's not for state seeks not to suck It's Florida State State seeks not to suck But again it could have been a Miami guy So yeah that's true That's fair I believe this was AI but regardless it was funny on his crap Love it Uh next week of the week here got to give a shout out as it has been officially announced meet the Pack Day and Victory Day are gonna be happening on August 16th Now the interesting thing and for those are unaware of what Victory Day is I have what's the name of the organization I know Greg's Playhouse Gigi's Playhouse Yeah basically in state football basically invite Gigi's Playhouse to come out to the stadium They do a lot of cool things They'll usually like one at a time allow you know entrance out of the tunnel onto the field which is really cool And then do like a couple of drills and allow each of the Gigi's playoffs members to score touchdown And and they it's really cool They have the play by or they have the the the stadium announcer there And you know for at least the first few he'll you know Touchdown Wolf Pack you know which is so cool So uh but the interesting the band there to plays the fight band after it Yeah yeah Mr Miss Wolf the cheerleaders all that they they they they they don't leave anything on any any any rock unturned here now but the interesting question which I have there Greg is the fact that they're on the same day as meet the Pack Day That's unique It's been like that a couple times for the last couple of years Yeah yeah I married definitely last year Um I this is probably the second or third year in a row they've done this They have done it where they were separate events Um but yeah they've been kind of combining it uh the last couple of years Uh huh uh Ethan do you feel like that there's gonna be high likelihood that a lot of NC State fans will be able to show to me the pack day and know exactly the names of the players that they're gonna Wanna go and and get besides CJ I mean let's be real CJ Bailey whatever line he's in just put put put the kickers near him You know I mean like like just just put the safety near him You know just I'll give them some love You know cause I can guarantee you that probably half the players are gonna be just sitting there tapping pins while the rest of the Wolf Magnes gonna be waiting the CJ Bay line I feel like yeah yeah yeah I I remember one of the ones that that I went to many years ago It was like that for Devin Leary and I go I was working that event or something and I mean it was like you say it out loud right And you're like oh yeah the lines gonna be way longer But seeing it in person you know it doesn't really you can't really explain it That doesn't do it justice And so yeah Bailey will certainly have a lot of autographs assigned a lot of a lot of babies to kiss and hands to shake right But um it'll be a good day for state It'll be a good day Victory Day is definitely one of the best things that they do And it's awesome It's awesome And um it does feel to me feels closer to the season starting this year than it has in the past is August 16th and they play on what the 29th 29th Yep yeah So that's a quicker turn around that I remember but either way it's a it's a great event as always Couple of pro tips real quick Uh they do separate the offensive side and defensive side on one each side of the stadium Last year the home team or the see me The offense was on the home side and um the quarterbacks were right closest to the Murphy Center That line is definitely the longest as everyone was alluding to So there is a strategy I save quarterbacks for last because by then the line dies So I start on defense and then go back to the offense so pro tip okay I like it from a pro I mean I have a I have five team helmets well actually just mean my 15 helmet so there you go It's kind of my kind of my thing for the cave so since we have Mr make on here with us here got to do a little bit little bit basketball Right So so John Rostein putting a tweet out talking about head coach Ryan Odom over Virginia saying that he has no plans to return a game at VCU in 2026 2027 but is willing to play the Rams in the future saying also to that VCU has previously put in its head coaches contracts that they were required to return for a game or provide a buy out when they took another job here So I making thoughts here first time seeing this seems a little bit different than what we did You know not going to get out of the one of BCU game for us I'm very curious to know what both Odom and Gainey are thinking They're other than to say it means to imagine it would be a quad one or and or a two game I would have kind of seen that have been fun one to play But um you know I wonder if it's probably it's gotta be something to do with the scheduling from a um a straight to schedule standpoint or um I don't know I don't I'm kind of curious what their reason is for not going to that game there But um maybe they feel like they got everything to lose in that situation Not much a game but it is a quad 1 2 game Probably cause I think it's Martelli's the coach of BCU there They got a pretty good program there Now so I don't see what you lose by playing at VCU other than you maybe be losing a major program if you lost But um I think BC is a fun team to play It's close by you kind of see another city So I kind of wish teams would fall through on that But there's probably there's got to be some strategy that I'm just not aware of this point Maybe it's probably not a probably not expensive game either So maybe it's exposure for recruiting I have no idea so Greg yeah I I I know you had originally sent this tweet to me You have any additional insight in terms of the reasoning why Odom declined this offer Um not 100 sure I do I did do some research Um as far as the second paragraph goes saying they previously put head coaches contracts that they required to return for a game Uh LSU did play in Richmond against VCU in 2020 Uh so uh I thought maybe Wade was doing that for from when he was at state cause that's how we ended up on the schedule But no it wasn't it was uh seems like it was an in an opposite of that But uh no I just I I think that it's a it's just a game that um maybe they already had their schedule locked in And cause from what I understand that they had to do it within their first three years of of accepting a new job Um so I don't think they're at the point where they have to quote unquote buy it out Do you and Ethan question for you do you feel like at all that if Virginia maybe have the same setup as the state of North Carolina does with playing North Carolina opponents this this might change things Maybe um like if Virginia Virginia Tech were required to play I don't like they already play twice though in the ACC I'm guessing aren't they the the rivalry matchup So they play twice I would imagine they would be the rivalry Yeah well rivalries don't mean nothing in terms of playing each other twice a year as we've Learned Well no he's talking about the ACC logs the match up Yeah I got you got you sorry I wonder if like the Ray Roth the way Roth Dean words this tweet it kind of sounds like the contracts changed So I I wonder if something from the VCU end tier changed where they don't put this into head coaching contracts Like maybe that cost them a coach that they wanted or something in the past I don't know but just throwing that out there from Ross scene kind of makes me think that hey you know things might have changed on on that end And that's why they're not doing it But hey we were very critical of state not playing this game And I would I would be critical of Virginia here in the same situation Um and that was my reason for posting this exactly Ethan Um just be like hey like another I I I tweeted this out It was like hey look another ACC team not willing to play VCU so everyone that was given in state needs to go back and give it to UVA as well That was that was my for sure my reasoning exactly Yeah no no for vis for Virginia I you know wasn't on the schedule So I guess maybe that's the difference But either way you know that sounds like a game that should have been played may as well been in the on the schedule If it was a contract So maybe they played a bio who knows But yeah absolutely I would be critical And Virginia was the second best team in the eighties Yeah yeah they were the second best team in the ACC They were a three seed in the NCAA Blade tournament They absolutely should have played a tougher non conference schedule last year that their non conference schedule was very very soft to the point where when they came to Raleigh what first second game of the of ACC play State was favored in that game Obviously Virginia ended up being much better than NC State but we didn't know that because state had gone out and challenge themselves and picked up a couple of good wins and Virginia hadn't done that So you know and I think that kind of went into the line being what it was And so you know again do I really care what Virginia is doing Not really But I don't you know seems like they're scheduling themselves awfully light relative to the type of program at least that they had in year one without them Yeah agreed So with that being said Wolfpack Nation here want to jump on over to really what is anchor this whole show here which is talking a little bit here I guess not talking debate a little bit here of the question of how many goats positional goats does NC State football have here So what we'll do is we'll go position by position We won't we won't debate who is the goat or who is the best But we're gonna debate is there an undisputed goat Now to define a little bit We're not necessarily gonna say that that 100 of NC State fans would say this is the best player that position But 90% like I'm sure I'm sure maybe Coin Robinson's family and he has a few fans are saying not Corn Robinson's to go here But let's start there The wide receiver position is anybody going to debate Tory Holt not being undisputed goat at wide receiver They should not I mean I don't think that's like I think they're I think you could dispute that is that isn't that the question Well just just I just I think him what would 90 of NC State fans say Somebody else besides Tory holes the base wide receiver Inc I think if you were to poll NC State fans I think the number would be less than 90 of fans would pick Tori Hilt Okay maybe I should lower you Who you going who you going to out there Jericho Cottry and Cottry Yeah yeah but Coren Robinson The problem with Robinson who's only two year guy People forget about guys like Heywood Jeffries and Mike Quick Yeah yeah but you know again because I think Tory Hole gives you the whole package all consensus all American ACC Player of the Year 1998 No 81 Retired by NC State and retired by NFL franchise So so he gives you the NFL part which you know isn't yeah true a big piece but it's AP sure and the fact that he gives you a a a stud of a college career as well So that's why my opinion fits in an undisputed kind of temple here especially when you compare these other positions which we're gonna talk about If this is not undisputed if this is not gonna somehow define itself as undisputed then we may struggle to find one for the rest of the show I maybe Let's go through it let's go through it This will be fun Okay okay all right well then let's you know cause cause Greg we won't necessarily go to to the Jericho Cottry uh you know Yin and yank here Well actually go straight to your heart Greg at running back here I I'm in a debate what so so making I'll ask you first is Ted Brown not the goat of running back 70 state And if you say anybody else besides Ted Brown Greg is gonna personally come I don't even know why you're even taking a breath on this one Yeah I'm trying to think of who I'm just making sure I could think of who else it could be It's not possible I mean it's really did I'm have you look just say press merovich I was the hell I was gonna say the joke honestly I was about to say press merovich as a joke You don't tell about that one later It was pretty fun But yeah classic comedy really isn't a there really isn't any competition that I can think of Um you've had some really good ones but they're they're like years and years ago Um the most college football hall of Fame is anyone else any other running back in the College Football Hall of Fame Nope If they counted Ted Brown's postseason yards like they count everybody else's he would still be probably No 1 in the ACC all time And he working last time he was 1979 He's got school record of 4,602 rushing hards 860 carries He's got almost 1,000 yards more than the next guy Yeah all right Travis ETM played like 30 extra games and barely has more only because they don't count Ted Brown's um numbers And I don't believe Ted Brown was able to play as freshman year because of college rules Somebody factored on with that But I'm pretty sure looking here the second Sports Reference has on the 40 I say Joe Mcintosh is probably the next best or Tremaine Stevens leave the two Tracy's remains awesome All I see all star over 35 hundred career yards career yards to Um Joe Mcintosh is second school history with 3,642 yards AC Rookie of the year But none of them kind of they're kind of all sniffing Ted Brown's dust right there So that's just gotta be Ted Brown yeah and then No 4 is Hollywood smothers Uh so uh haha What Uh no So yeah alright so okay so so I guess Ted Brown is is is the I guess the bar for for undisputed at at a at a in state football position alright so let's drop on over to to quarterback here anybody can argue Philip Rivers Well I can make an argument Okay this one's this one's disputable It is disputable but here's the problem and this is the problem when you get into the goat conversation Different errors play the game differently Um you can look at a guy like Roman Gabriel I will say you can say Roman Gabriel Yeah but again where it's gotta hurt him is the stat lines Because again that was a error where you ran the ball 50 times a game and through 10 15 times a game Um get a little hyperbole there but you get the point Um but he was that kind of first second generation of past throwers Um that kind of defined what it meant to go vertical um but I think I think it's still gonna be probably Philip Rivers But to Ethan Point I think you would I think here you would The problem here is you have Russell Wilson you have Philip Rivers you have Roman Gabriel the vote would get split here a lot but um I think because of of the times we are in people have short term memory I think people would say Philip Rivers I mean I I I'm I'm I'm sure probably at least 40 50 of people would pick probably Phillip Rivers Am I am I crazy in saying that No I think he would get the majority and then you get the split with Russell You would get the respect I think from everybody's fans even if they weren't there Like for me like Russell Wilson was a guy that made me maybe love football watch football I mean I came in I still remember watching the game where he had the 2 yard Hail Mary against UNC I mean I still remember where I was watching that and that was like honestly one of my earliest memories for me watching a state football game I love Russell Wilson I think the conversation looks differently if he plays his grad year and doesn't go to to Wisconsin I think the I think the conversation is vastly different right But but you objectively looking up you know black and white the numbers just go to Philip Rivers So you and he was the only person who's ever had like a us 10 win season the state so you have that kind of going with them too They beat Notre Dame And when Notre Dame was still kind of riding high a little bit maybe not as high as they had been but yeah yeah but I mean like the other guy go ahead Well statistically like he's not on those guys level Mike Lennon but Ryan Finley had played a fourth year Like he would be up there Actually he played his whole career right because he played young boys He's day two It's something like he only played three in NC State Yeah Ryan Finley second school history and career completions in fourth and passing touchdowns He's thrown over 10,000 yards like nobody's taking him over any of those guys No right nobody would pick him in in this But you know if you extrapolate those numbers out over another season Hey fun fact rapping I think went on to be a kind of amp like a pro kickball player Yeah Pro Pickleball is great What Yeah yeah look it up Yeah that's amazing I just watched the pickleball movie last night on Apple TV Dink anyway interesting Yeah uh but yeah okay so that's good that's good debate there But uh so you know we will save believe it or not disputed for that one uh tight end Carrie Angeline I mean Carrie Angeline George Bryant honestly is the name that comes to mind for me Honestly yeah yeah just never had a real dominant guy No no yeah yeah I mean cause I'm like Count Jalen Samuel Well he was might be in there Is Jolie in that at all at this point He only played two years I know but like you've been to which is a lot Now it is a lot Yeah I mean if maybe if you're counting Jalen Samuels like Jalen Samuels is twelve on the all time all time in scrimmage yards yeah that was nasty I just looked this up I didn't even look at the list here until we all talk about it But all four of the guys we just talked about are literally the top four of that AI pops up Like it says Jalen Samuel George Brian Justin Jolie Carry Antoine Well cause here's my thing though Ethan is that yes technically Jalen Samuel spent I think it was two years with the tight ends now But wasn't he the smallest time man I thought he was listed I thought he was listed as a running back He was it was it was it was honestly an RB slash tight end like that's cause cause cause he would he would be the the the Moses I mean a lot of times Yeah um so that's why they would list him at tight end Because he be listed because he would spend a lot of time in the tight end slot But again he just he's you just look at him he's not a tight end he's truly a running back wide receiver Swiss Army knife truly yeah I mean how many times did he run the jet sweep from the tight end position right across something funny here if we want to do loopholes here we could say Garrett Bradbury is the greatest NC State titan of all time Because he tamed NC State as a tight end and then went to offensive line as zero stars Remington Trophy Yeah well so but it's a touchdown Okay he did ECU and got 15 yard penalty for it Okay worth every worth every inch there I do want to jump it off It's a lie but I just want to confirm though tight end if we're gonna Count Jalen Samuels Jalen Samuels But if you're going to say not so much then totally disputed there correct Yeah yeah okay alright so offensive line Jim Rector Me hmm yeah I don't know man again I I in the it might be a little bit of recency bias here man I feel like the meme where Ben Affleck is like smoking It's like I mean does Joe tuning not deserve a mention that much Jim how many awards did Joe tuning win is the answer but yeah primary is honestly one Bill Yose also in that conversation correct Dick Christie one best center Yeah yeah yeah he won the I've got another guy You haven't even mentioned yet And this is to me this is the problem with yeah this is the problem with offensive line It's like what numbers are you really going right off right right It's really hard it's all about yeah like you know we can get over accolade is really yeah right IKEA Quanu was a three year starter started as a true freshman which is never which I shouldn't say never but rarely happens Rare played the most important position on the line And when did he go fifth in the draft six yeah but there's six I think six more opposite player taking that year and first ACC player I believe I who's the one Oh first ACC I got you Okay yeah I believe I I I know that's good The problem is is again the measuring stick on offensive people right and you tend to go with guys that have awards and again Victor won the Outland in 79 was a consensus All Americans in the College Football Hall of Fame Like he has the accolades that matter when you're quote unquote looking for a goat at any position especially one where there aren't true statistics Yeah well and and for me and for me it's it's again it just Joe tuning for me is is cause Joe Tony is one of the few officer line we're talking about that He played every single position on the offensive line he played center he played guard he played tackle He also too has probably one if not the most impressive NFL resumes in NC State football history so far I know but again hey listen I went back to our argument a few weeks ago when we had this very like no you know but you know funny thing about Joe tuning for me What I remember him the most from Mincy State is this hair the shake it off video the shake it off video That's exactly where I was going That was exactly where I'm going if anyone out there listening doesn't know what we're talking about do NC State weight room shake it off It is one of the funniest Dang videos You got Catavia Street in there BJ Hill They're all just dancing Taylor Swift but I barely Bradley troubles in there as well It is a very very funny especially when you look at what they've all accomplished to this day It is super funny I'm trying to look up who you can still kind of look up historical like recruiting profiles Some of these guys like what I can tell Joe Toony only had an offer from INCY state that so far that I can see I know I know like guys like Russell Dear Bradbury I think only was offered by Charlotte and us Yeah now I will say when you talking goats like we did break it down and kept it very general as far as offensive line But you could break those guys down into certain positions And I think you would be fine with pretty much all the guys we just mentioned Yeah no I like it inter state football could create one dominant offensive line for sure over its history for sure But so it sounds like to me that that it's with offensive line I kind of put it maybe in the wide receiver category where a majority 70 80 are gonna say Jim Richer But then there might be arguments for an icky you know for Bill Yost etc Am I my kind of coerizing them correctly Yeah wasn't Dick Christie an offensive lineman Can anyone I thought he was but I could be could be wrong on that to Christie man I should know that honestly feel like we should stuffy talk here but somebody's screaming at their computer screen right now being like why these guys not know this Yeah I'm just trying to remember He's gotta know his number is retired too So well while we look it up here I wanna go ahead I do wanna go ahead and jump start the conversation though now and switch to the defense side here And I actually wanna go to defensive line here Uh as I think I think it's what is it He's a halfback So then I could have been in a conversation with running back Okay still not brown continue so defensive line I feel like defensive line is a two headed monster with Mario Williams and Bradley Chubb Now Manny Lawson I feel like is another name that's that's up there But do we feel like that it will be probably a majority split between Mario Williams and Bradley Chubb Anybody else against the screen Are you doing defensive line as a whole or by position Right so um I feel like you gotta go as a whole Do you are you counting are you counting Chubb as a d line or as a linebacker d line Okay yeah I'll probably count d line He started out linebacker and just kind of right he plays more linebacker pros But listen I I I don't I think I think I don't remember who was was was Dave Huxtable still the defense coordinator I I I'm pretty sure he he would probably get fired on spot if he if Bradley Trobb brought drop back into coverage Uh you know much if not maybe more than once a game uh which I mean he had great hands for sure but dude that dude was so dominant past brush rushing like you had to make sure he we went at it all times possible here But um so yeah so so just just to keep a simple step saying well are we talking nose tackle Are we talking defensive tackle Are we talking just defensive line Yeah if you had an offensive line for me it's Mario Williams and it's not close um Mario Williamson's not close Yeah so you would put you wouldn't even made it Why is that Uh just for a couple of like Mario Williams has the all time sack record uh for a single season um was the first ACC player ever drafted at No 1 overall in the NFL Draft Um probably hmm I think I know he was all American at least once but maybe twice Um I don't think he won any actually awards though And I think Bradley did right correct Bradley won Defensive Player of the year Yeah um oh strike Greg you sure yeah I'm still going Mario Hmm okay it's close though it's close It's got to be disputable right it's that yeah it is disputed Did I say undisputed Did I say that well just it wasn't close Yeah I was a better player than Ted Brown I thought that's what I heard you say Apples and oranges son apples are true not true but it's my opinion and all that matters That's right But either would you be wrong would you give us Would you get would you would you kind of give a chub though a little bit of a nod over Mario This is kind of where you get into like the generations thing Like to me this is correct Like we're talking about Jim Richter with offensive line Like he might be the right answer but he wouldn't get the most amount of votes right now just because the younger people voting are gonna know have any idea So like for me I was at school at the same time as Bradley Chubb you know so it's like okay like you know you kind of had a front row seat to it So yeah to me these like this is truly 50 fifty And I know there's been other great defensive linemen as well I don't want to take away from those guys I'm sure some will get picked But here's what yeah let me just throw this out to you and give your opinion supporting cast for Bradley versus Mario Right and I think yeah terms of like the rest of the d line when they played like Bradley Chubbs Yeah but I think I think Bradley Chubbs's defensive line was better than Mario Williams's defensive line Yeah yeah I would say I would say it's close I would say Mario had one guy that was better than the other three but I would say yes in terms of the other three combined Bradley Chubb I think had better than what Mario had Yes I mean everyone is that reason to is that reason to vote for one over the other Well I just think because of like you can't double team certain guys right because you know if you if you've got a really stout d line you gotta play everybody straight up And so you know I feel like Mario and again I don't have any like definitive video proof of this But it does feels like Mario got double teamed more than Bradley chubbed it All right so I want to cut us off there just because again the point of this is we still have a couple of positions here to get to But so I think we'll leave it as definitely disputed but sounds like for sure It's a two headed monster at the top with Mario and chub but linebacker So again for me it's Peyton Wilson For for me Peyton he was he was the everything you need in a linebacker guy Like he was everything that you could want in a linebacker guy with speed a guy who could cover the pass a guy who could who could who could rush the passer again having eight have sex in 2023 a guy that could lead the locker room and a guy that could make plays that you're not asking him that that that you normally wouldn't ask for him to make either So my vote is that not to say that's undisputed for sure I think definitely linebacker position is going to be disputed But for me I'm kind of taking the the Greg rat where I think it's Peyton Wilson has a a solid edge above above everybody else Yeah for me he was I do think like the reasons he biased with Peyton kind of catches it where he just straight up carried that 2023 team I mean you could argue that Drake Thomas was better than him when they were both on the roster at NC State you know and so that's why to me like it's hard to I don't like It does feel like it's got to be one of these two guys for me Um again us real recency bias there But um and obviously there's there's been others further back But um I don't know Like I I feel like we remember Peyton as what he was in his 2023 season that was I I mean what like on the shortlist of the best individual football seasons that a player NC State has had But you know like he got hurt and missed a couple of seasons Like some of the other linebackers were more productive than him when they were all here together So again you won't find a bigger Peyton Wilson fan than me But I think this has to be for me has to be the speed I know you said that Layton But I mean like we for our old dreams was and well rounded yeah uh making Would you uh would you agree I know you said pay Wilson was dominant but would you add anything to Ethan's comments on that I'm just kind of looking online to talk Honestly I don't remember all these guys I'm trying to remember all these guys Uh yeah I'm looking at this guy I'm looking Lavar Fisher stats man He was a beast ace him in the first team two time first team always to see first team All American in 2,001 He LED the let the country in 2,015.1 tackles per game Um he's predog and then they got that They're on Dame Tony and Burnett on this list so um pretty awesome This was this is some articles that I'm looking for back in like 2019 when Peyton Wilson wasn't even around I probably would by to compare pain Wilson stuff to Lavar Although he did win best defensive player of the year um might get the slight edge show to Lavar but he wasn't best defensive player in the mid country So I don't know it's close It would be debatable for sure pop it into to pitch it to you Greg Because I mean like you know we mention of our Fisher Stephen Tulloch another name that comes up obviously to you You can't talk all time great linebackers will not mention Bill Cower's name Yeah he was mine he was mine Again we've talked about this before He he twice had 24 tackles in a game 24 tackles in a game Like that's absurd um holds the single season record for NC State um again just didn't get some of those national awards that you're that you're kind of like when you're splitting hairs with the goats right you always again give those accolades That's probably what's holding him back uh again we've talked about it before different eras you know you're asking different things of the linebacker schemes were different You know they probably ran different schemes so again you're asking different things from them Um status had a history of really really good linebackers like some of the names like um Nate Irving Yeah like I was exactly a dude Nate Irving We haven't even talked about him Yeah Audi Cole was another good one that that had a couple good seasons Terrell Manning Terrell Manning was one and then an old school guy that was part of like the Saints defenses of old Von Johnson like way before your guys's time Um yeah like this is I think when you're doing GOATs for linebackers this is the one position group that you need to break it down by the actual position You know what Sam Mike or will Um I think you have to break it down in position because state has had so many really good All Americans all ACCs Um yeah yeah but yeah I think again if you're going from a national perspective um it's probably gonna be Peyton just because I'm winning the the the the the Belinda cop What was it Bernard Bernard Bernard and Buckish and the nerd Yeah so yeah nope so i i think we're in agreement there on that so i do wanna ask y'all's opinion in terms of defensive backs Would you split up by safety and cornerback or would you go defensive back altogether Yeah okay agreed So altogether Adrian Wilson he's up there David Anderson had a pretty nice one season correct that next year it was ugly I still have flashbacks next year to see the height was so big Yeah hmm yeah now now David Anderson did give you one of the greatest uh graphics of all time where during the Clemson game where they showed how we had 13 interceptions And they showed like a list of other top 25 teams that he single handedly has more interceptions than that is one of the sickest graphics of all time But yes I mean I do agree It's it's hard to put him as a goat in a goat conversation when his last year was so bad So but yeah I mean Adrian Wilson dominant college five time pro ball safety which I know Greg that's pro so I get it but no but it but what what But when it goes Yang and Yang like that so beautifully it's hard in my opinion argue anybody besides Adrian Wilson Anybody else have another name you want to throw him besides Adrian or or saving him could be in that conversation Earl Wolf was pretty good Earl Wolf's up there in terms of conversation 11 lost careers which I think that's probably with us in the full time Yeah probably one of those guys out there I mean my thing with Terrence Old is if you if you added in what he did on special teams cause I would say in terms of special teams not returner Terrence Old has few huge plays that he made on special teams But I so so what are we doing in terms of percentage uh you know with Adrian Wilson What do we put him as a 50 60 vote guy or maybe a little bit higher I was wondering if he had to put a David Hamerson I don't know his that one season even though it was one season was so good It was like they you've got a gift that some extra clout to it that almost like it you know it kind of outweighs the bad season a little bit because it was so good You just you just wish that it was just flipped He was never the same after that either though like even like again I know we're not talking pro but since you mentioned it like he was not a good pro like he was in and out of the league pretty quickly Um right Dwayne Washington was the first round Dwayne Washington good call good call Pittsburgh Steelers Minnesota Vikings I think correct So so probably 50 60 brain Washington was really good but I think not undisputed yeah but not undisputed no Um yeah we just haven't had a grip You know now you're looking at this and we're breaking it down Like we just haven't had a great history at that position right in the deep back Um we don't I feel like Adrian Wilson might be it Now that I'm thinking about it yeah in terms of just a career you add in what he did with the pros again it's just it's just it's it for me it's another Tory whole situation where like it's hard to argue you know otherwise so um but okay but here's one though that I think could be undisputed punter Anybody wanna argue against AJ Cole I'd have to go back That's had a pretty good run of punters Yeah we had another loot We had others ago who averaged he had like he was like 50 yards upon some like that Just here's my thing is in it goes back to it's a little bit tough and turns Okay how you know like I would say offensive like kind of the conversation we have with offensive line where it's like okay what do we really go by So for me Greg I kind of this is the one position I feel like you gotta take into account a little bit what he's done the pros because I mean if I mean if your first team all pro and punting which can keep mind I mean punting There's there's not a huge change between as there is with other positions between college and pro So if he's able to go to pro and he's able to do so well that he can get first team all Pro Yeah that says a lot that says a lot Yeah yeah yeah it's either probably him or Johnny Evans Um Johnny Evans was a consensus All American um but Johnny Evans didn't have 58 pounds Yeah that's how good we were I'm just kidding I don't know what about so in that conversation at all he's top five I would say he's top five Gill and newcaster average more yards for a Gill was at 45 points That's the least that's what I was thinking of It's it was Cole or Gill to ask him or Gill's name Yeah Gill had like almost 46 yards Yeah but punt at where AJ Cole really excelled was when he hit the NFL Uh huh yeah yeah I mean Gil Gil was 2.7 yards per punt better like he was first right after his soul was he right after him though Uh huh yeah he was Well that's the craziest thing you got any better you're like well this dude's just as good well the reason AJ Cole is so good is cause the Raiders punt like every damn possession So he's got plenty of practice Um yep yep no Ethan but you you were saying though yeah I I mean statistically like I I wouldn't argue with AJ Cole But statistically Gill and Newcaster were both better on a per pun basis And the volume is pretty close to where Cole was So yeah and punting gets weird because you get penalized for in the end zone So you really you know you have the yards and air if you will And then you have your net average after the return So you know to me to me the net average is what really matters um because that has everything to do with you know the whole the whole operation if you will Um so I don't I don't know if you go off net yards or or or I don't know What what is the statistic they actually call it like gross I guess gross yards I don't think gross yeah yeah yeah yeah so it just depends on what you value But just like you said I what a what a stint there going from will bombing to AJ Cole to Trenton Gill That's yeah yeah I still see him around quite a bit will bombing you can't miss him dude 6 foot 6 so we've had some tall punters really tall punters yeah no kidding long legs Yeah yeah alright so with that being said let's wrap it up right here We are doing it we're doing it Greg we're doing it Okay fine we're not doing it Chris Dunz go We appreciate y'all tuning in here thank you so now all right here's my thing Chris Dunn first and foremost the first time I'm actually gonna bring up y'all 200 for 200 on extra points in his career never missed an extra point his entire career which is crazy I ninety seven career field goals I broke the interstate record in just three seasons and state passing Nicks 80 I 2022 Luke Rosa Award winner only missed one field goal that season 2022 I and also two as well If this matters to you Greg which I know you're always up for the show here to as well But he had this beat that you just hear it and you go and you go okay so that means I could so when this plays I can go to the bathroom I go to the bathroom I go refill my popcorn That scoreboard is going up by three points automatically like like you know so the couple things you also didn't mention well yeah go ahead unless you have them No he's the all time NCAA points leader and ACC obviously if he's the NCAA now Luke and you did yeah now you did mention that he broke the state record in three years Do we put an astric next to his some of his records because he did play at state for five years Thanks thanks to Covid but everybody's been playing five years now Yeah it's fair sir What So yeah good point I mean way to shut that down Ethan darn you even I think at the time like yeah at the time yeah like Nick and Nicholas Sadie But he's he's also 160 scored 160 more points than Sadie you know so it's kind of like statistically he was far away so much better just kind of hard to It's a good argument like I would definitely hear it Yeah what if I can make it sorry if I can make one more case though for for done Uh just because people said this in in the comments when I put the tweet out there calling him to go And then we could talk about Mark Permonte here Uh is the fact that people said well like what was like his biggest moment was him recovering the on side kick for Shuancy And honestly like listen I the fact if he did not execute that on sidekick as perfectly as he did we wouldn't have beaten you And see we wouldn't have pulled off that that miraculous comeback ever she would see but also to another game which I thought of too as well If I can piggyback my name would just be Greg in the Lord and corner That's true you would just be just Greg so thanks to Chris Dan Oh Chris what you're saying Greg No Chris Dino is me I sent him part of my medical Bill He was not interested in it so but the other but the other thing as well a game which I think of that we wouldn't have won if it wasn't for him against playing against Florida State where Devin Leery gets injured And it was basically you know oh yeah man you know let's just get let's just get inside the 40 and kick it We did not complete one pass after half time I know that was probably the most improbable football win I've ever seen Yeah exactly yeah they did it Yeah they were probably fun and enjoy interception to us in the end zone for no reason Yeah yeah just they didn't trust their kicker They didn't trust their kicker Yeah I remember that I forgot that guy That was crazy yeah because that they were inside the 30 I think faded it into the back of the end zone So the nobody guy and it grabbed it But it was like who was he throwing to wasn't even close Why would you throw it Well there are some other guys that live that have kicked for in state of that have been very good that might be more known from their pro days like Mike Kofer uh kick for the Forty Niners I believe he has at least one Super Bowl ring might have two Um there was a guy that kicked uh Steven Huska I think I'm saying his last name Roshka Huska Yeah Steven Hoska The Seahawks kick for a while yeah kick for a while kick for the bills for a while too um yeah the bills for a while He was so yeah he was a one year guy at state Yeah and that was the probably that that was kind of the problem with um Mark Right And he only kick one or two years two years Yeah so yep so again I I so even after hearing all the evidence here Greg I still feel like there is a a a a spacer between Kristine and the rest of the names mentioned it Lane yeah I laid I'm with you personally like I get he's probably a more fool himself but I'm with you Lane I I there's there's been some good things to make you say you mentioned say Houska done cremani Yeah cremani did win the Luther Oh Hartman we never talk about Hartman Yeah Damon Hartman Yeah mmm hmm his claim was like he kicked like a like a 58 59 yarder at the buzzer to beat Carolina um that's called back in like the early 90s um might have been late 80s but yeah something like that Yeah what was that what was that It's like almost throwing up the bat signal It totally is no I look it's hard to argue when you have numbers in accolades again That's what a goat is and people can hate on it all they want It just kind of is what it is Yeah I mean he has like an 86 we really need in this Yeah oh I love you Greg I love it I do man So my biggest question then becomes like does he become a College Football Hall of Famer Uh yeah I mean again he probably does honestly probably should probably meet 500 on X by the way we're all kind of grimacing at it because we just think oh he's fooling stuff It's like the dude was pretty great I mean so like that's insane 200 200 extra points that's crazy got hardware it's got records Uh huh I mean if I don't scream goat I don't know what does I mean It would be like saying like LeBron James is the goat and he's the all time leading scorer in the NBA but Michael Jordan is the goat I agree I agree Yeah so I guess what you and see but I hate saying it I hate saying it But but I'm just saying like when you the all time leading score in a sport like if that don't put you in the conversation Yeah yeah I agree I agree Alright so with that being said though I do want to give the floor real quick to my man Ethan here who's been doing some again I already mentioned the patron one time which again It's it's it's the craziest value There is again getting 12 videos a month for only five bucks plus our members only rumor chat to as well But Ethan what's your name Well yeah oh yeah so so Ethan what what what you know what you've been working on recently What you work on here today Yeah yeah well I I thought of uh this last night and I was so excited about it I couldn't couldn't sleep Let me ask you guys this oh who do you think will be NC State's starting quarterback in 12 months Uh yeah we so again for the 5 5 rule being a thing for sure Yeah well Bailey's only at 4 so yeah but just real quick just give me a name just give me a name doesn't have to be you know don't need a spiel just you don't need context man I'm gonna say I'm gonna say the only little thing if Bailey wants to come back it's Bailey but Willie that's the question well you said 400 provide a name so it's making said Bailey so your name No okay so here I'm gonna say will he No I think it's we need a name sir I think it's big gunner I think it's big gunner because I think Bailey's been good enough season good enough season to go Layton Will Wilson baby Greg that's a fourth mess fourth and will fourth and will well I'm gonna break this tie I'm going Gunner Rivers I think And that's not necessarily who I agree with but you asked me who I think will be the quarterback Who you think it'll be I think it's gunner I think this is going to be a fascinating next 12 months I think this is going to be just fast Like I can't think of another way to describe it So I talked about that today You know it's not that big of a it's not that big of a storyline right now It's July 27th but in four five months this is all anybody's gonna be talking about the wheels are in motion I really think three options is gonna have a good enough season where he's going to want to go and states gonna be like man yeah go for it Go on or it's good enough to where he's gonna get paid somewhere else And he's not gonna get paid enough his first year in the NFL where he can make again one of those where you can make more in college especially the way that the ways to go do it this year he didn't like isn't that a thing happened this year So what made him good we talked about that Ethan and I talked about this on a previous podcast why we think he's still here Like so would state not be the highest bidder again next year I don't know not next year It depends on the season he gives you I talked about the situation it depends on the service value that we get I talk I talk about this Yeah there's gonna be some conversations had that's for sure And Layton I like your pick of Will Wilson I just would you want to be quarterback with Gunner Rivers staring over absolutely not absolutely not So anyway I talked about that today on the Patreon It was a fun conversation I look forward to exceeding that conversation Let me ask you this question Obviously Bailey or rivers will have a stronger NIO pool for next season like bringing money in next season the nil the gun rivers in alumni and Sea State could get over Bailey Who will be eating Bailey be stronger Are you talking about which which who would get paid more No no who could pull in or like who could pull in the most strong Well I think you're saying this wrong I think it's a good question I I think you're saying who can drum up more support from the fan base for money in general right maybe not necessarily NYL anything something for fans So yeah it is to me if Bailey I like that question If Bailey has a big gear I think the answer is Bailey If people are just kind of tired of Bailey I think the answer is gonna reverse Listen there will there will be some interesting bodily reactions from Missy State fans seeing a No 17 bodily run onto the field Dude they'll be there'll be some head nods like oh my god there's a 17 running onto the field right now And oh dude I'm telling you man I I I the way I see it is I know these conversations are being had and because Greg's in the room when it's no no but these discussions were probably had before Gunner Rivers committed Like like I'm sure there is a plan that was putting place Um and it could be an instance where again I have no inside information on this I I know Will Wilson was paid nicely for a backup for quarterback this year cause you need the insurance plan next year I I don't think Will Wilson's gonna blow another year just to sit No no I just I just don't That'll be three years because at some point right agreed uh at some point teams aren't gonna be as interested in you When you have no film at the college level and all they're seeing is you're running the ball Bailey leaves If Bailey leaves is it a quarterback competition Is it a true quarterback It should be it should be but I don't think it would be Wait you can't you can't put all your eggs in in the uh in the Gunner Rivers basket but we did for his dad why not it's true that's true I mean you would bring another quarterback in Like it's not you have to be good again It's just right it's true freshman that's that's just that's just but it's but you're bringing another quarterback that has experience and has like like they're just there to have a good time right make a make a few dollars Like if they're if they're shoved into service that's fine but I don't think they're bringing in a quarterback it's to challenge Gunner Rivers it's a Tad Hudson type like it's a you know Tad Hudson Tad Hudson all right y'all Yeah well so with that being said Wolfpack Nation again make sure to go check our Patreon again only$5 a month Link down description below go sign up join here today You can check out that amazing video from Ethan plus 11 other videos per month for only$5 a month So make sure to go and check it out With that being said Wolf fact nation thank you force the channel and also to as well make sure that our video gets out there for more and see state fans And if you haven't already will thank nation make sure also give us follow at Toughie Dock now on Twitter Instagram TikTok We are active on those So make sure to go and follow us on all of our social media and also too again make sure to give it make sure to give a big shout out in the comments to as well which is doing yeah yeah okay with that being said Wolf fact nation though We will see you all soon and as always y'all go